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	<title>Comments on: The Business of persistent links</title>
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	<link>http://librarystaff.blogs.lincoln.ac.uk/2009/04/20/the-business-of-persistent-links/</link>
	<description>Sharing information about our work at the University.</description>
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		<title>By: EBSCO in Cahoots With Harvard Business Press &#124; Disruptive Library Technology Jester</title>
		<link>http://librarystaff.blogs.lincoln.ac.uk/2009/04/20/the-business-of-persistent-links/comment-page-1/#comment-173</link>
		<dc:creator>EBSCO in Cahoots With Harvard Business Press &#124; Disruptive Library Technology Jester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 18:12:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://librarystaff.blogs.lincoln.ac.uk/?p=1016#comment-173</guid>
		<description>[...] but there are indications that EBSCO is disabling the deep links to HBP content. There are reports of HBP asking libraries to pay an additional fee to EBSCO for the ability to have deep linking for [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] but there are indications that EBSCO is disabling the deep links to HBP content. There are reports of HBP asking libraries to pay an additional fee to EBSCO for the ability to have deep linking for [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Keene</title>
		<link>http://librarystaff.blogs.lincoln.ac.uk/2009/04/20/the-business-of-persistent-links/comment-page-1/#comment-157</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Keene</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jun 2009 15:49:29 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>How do Harvard know the Universities in question are linking to them? 

Most VLE pages require a login (and so can&#039;t be access by Google etc), and the web logs for the journal (which would show a &#039;referer&#039; - the page the user came from to which the journal) we be on the Ebsco servers. 

Are Ebsco sharing their log files with Harvard?

Chris</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How do Harvard know the Universities in question are linking to them? </p>
<p>Most VLE pages require a login (and so can&#8217;t be access by Google etc), and the web logs for the journal (which would show a &#8216;referer&#8217; &#8211; the page the user came from to which the journal) we be on the Ebsco servers. </p>
<p>Are Ebsco sharing their log files with Harvard?</p>
<p>Chris</p>
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		<title>By: Stuart Smith</title>
		<link>http://librarystaff.blogs.lincoln.ac.uk/2009/04/20/the-business-of-persistent-links/comment-page-1/#comment-34</link>
		<dc:creator>Stuart Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Apr 2009 09:28:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://librarystaff.blogs.lincoln.ac.uk/?p=1016#comment-34</guid>
		<description>Chris Flegg&#039;s point....Also the very important and highly contentious question of Harvard assuming a right to dictate (and EBSCO acquiescing) to EBSCO the individual conditions that any single libraries will have imposed on them.... reminds me of the Nexis / FT saga. It is very irritating to have to deal with exceptions and clauses in services which we believe we have already paid for. I think aggregators need to take more responsiblity for what they are doing ie &#039;aggregating&#039; and stick up a bit more for us the end user.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris Flegg&#8217;s point&#8230;.Also the very important and highly contentious question of Harvard assuming a right to dictate (and EBSCO acquiescing) to EBSCO the individual conditions that any single libraries will have imposed on them&#8230;. reminds me of the Nexis / FT saga. It is very irritating to have to deal with exceptions and clauses in services which we believe we have already paid for. I think aggregators need to take more responsiblity for what they are doing ie &#8216;aggregating&#8217; and stick up a bit more for us the end user.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Flegg</title>
		<link>http://librarystaff.blogs.lincoln.ac.uk/2009/04/20/the-business-of-persistent-links/comment-page-1/#comment-33</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Flegg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Apr 2009 08:11:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://librarystaff.blogs.lincoln.ac.uk/?p=1016#comment-33</guid>
		<description>As one of the libraries who has had their deep-linking removed after refusing to pay, I have been agitating and sending out messages back to EBSCO and to any forum that is prepared to pick this one up as the issues for libraries and individuals are quite, in my view, profound, and it is absolutely critical that this gets out and gets debated in open forums rather than through controlled correspondence between EBSCO and individual libraries.

At stake is not just the issue of deep-linking as a web feature but more fundamentally it hits on three nerves: whether or not deep-linking is permissible under copyright and under the current terms and conditions of database usage: if it is, then Harvard would seem to have little right to ask for additional payment just because libraries make a cost-sensible decision to use the advantages of that technology,
regardless of how this affects Harvard’s bottom line. Also the very important and highly contentious question of Harvard assuming a right to dictate (and EBSCO acquiescing) to EBSCO the individual conditions that any single libraries will have imposed on them and which may be called “punitive” : equally EBSCO’s acquiescence to go along with this command - if our contracts of access are with EBSCO, then surely
they are not with Harvard? Nowhere in my recollection is there an agreement that costs to a content provider may be increased at will for whomever Harvard feels owes them some “loss-of-revenue”
penalty? And may other publishers then follow suit? of content to EBSCO might dictate

Lastly, is the most worrying underlying principle of all and one that should be ringing really loud warning bells to all libraries who believe they are free to use new technologies to advance their service deliveries - if Harvard can postulate what they see as a “loss-of revenue” case, on what arguable and measurable basis may we debate the extent of that loss - and for how may years into the future and at what rate? if you consider this point alone it becomes quite ridiculous. Could Harvard for example argue that they think we could have made more use in two years time of course packs and that their revenue COULD
have gone up and on that basis increase annually the additional deep-linking charge to what they feel MIGHT HAVE been ??

What exactly could the future look like for any of us if any commercial provider can get away with imposition of a cost on a “perceived” loss of revenue, a cost which, in the absence of any actual transactional data must in effect be an arbitrarily derived figure?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As one of the libraries who has had their deep-linking removed after refusing to pay, I have been agitating and sending out messages back to EBSCO and to any forum that is prepared to pick this one up as the issues for libraries and individuals are quite, in my view, profound, and it is absolutely critical that this gets out and gets debated in open forums rather than through controlled correspondence between EBSCO and individual libraries.</p>
<p>At stake is not just the issue of deep-linking as a web feature but more fundamentally it hits on three nerves: whether or not deep-linking is permissible under copyright and under the current terms and conditions of database usage: if it is, then Harvard would seem to have little right to ask for additional payment just because libraries make a cost-sensible decision to use the advantages of that technology,<br />
regardless of how this affects Harvard’s bottom line. Also the very important and highly contentious question of Harvard assuming a right to dictate (and EBSCO acquiescing) to EBSCO the individual conditions that any single libraries will have imposed on them and which may be called “punitive” : equally EBSCO’s acquiescence to go along with this command &#8211; if our contracts of access are with EBSCO, then surely<br />
they are not with Harvard? Nowhere in my recollection is there an agreement that costs to a content provider may be increased at will for whomever Harvard feels owes them some “loss-of-revenue”<br />
penalty? And may other publishers then follow suit? of content to EBSCO might dictate</p>
<p>Lastly, is the most worrying underlying principle of all and one that should be ringing really loud warning bells to all libraries who believe they are free to use new technologies to advance their service deliveries &#8211; if Harvard can postulate what they see as a “loss-of revenue” case, on what arguable and measurable basis may we debate the extent of that loss &#8211; and for how may years into the future and at what rate? if you consider this point alone it becomes quite ridiculous. Could Harvard for example argue that they think we could have made more use in two years time of course packs and that their revenue COULD<br />
have gone up and on that basis increase annually the additional deep-linking charge to what they feel MIGHT HAVE been ??</p>
<p>What exactly could the future look like for any of us if any commercial provider can get away with imposition of a cost on a “perceived” loss of revenue, a cost which, in the absence of any actual transactional data must in effect be an arbitrarily derived figure?</p>
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